Pre-existence verses used for Jesus

                                                        Pre-existence verses used for Jesus



Alleged Pre-existence verses

 

Micah 5:2 English Standard Version 2 But YOU, O Bethlehem Ephrathah, who are too little to be among the clans of Judah, from YOU shall come forth FOR ME one who is to be ruler in Israel, whose coming forth is from of old, from ancient days.

 

NOTE: This verse should be rendered "whose coming prophecy is from ancient times." This prophecy is given in 2 Samuel 7, 1 Chronicles 17, and Psalm 2. The Hebrew words are qedem (ancient) and olam (old). They do not refer to an eternal past, but to a historical period within Israelite antiquity. See usage in Amos 9:11; Psalm 44:1-3, 77:5,11; Micah 7:14,20; Isaiah 63:11. Furthermore, Matthew 2:5-6 does not even quote the phrase "old and ancient days." A careful read can show that the Messiah is coming out of the Tribe of Judah. It says "FOR ME." That means FOR GOD the FATHER. This passage can also apply to King Hezekiah in Isaiah 37:15-38.

 

 

 

 

John 3:13 King James Version13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but HE that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.

NOTE: One argument suggests that Heaven is Jesus' origin/source. For example, the John's method of baptism (Jesus was not baptizing angels in Heaven now), the Manna (Exodus 16:4; Psalm 78:23-25, 105:40), and gifts from above (Malachi 3:10), etc. See James 1:17, 3:17; Matthew 21:25; Mark 1:11, 8:11, 11:30; Luke 3:22, 21:11, 22:43; John 3:37, 6:32, 8:23, 19:11; Proverbs 2:6 (ERV); Philippians 3:20. 

SIDE NOTE: Manna did not literally fell out of the sky. It appeared on the ground. There is no text that says the people witnessed it fall from the sky. Exodus 16:13-14. We use similar language like "they are an angel from Heaven," or "a match made in Heaven", and "Heaven sent."

 

An alternative argument is that the "He" is actually the Holy Spirit who has descended upon Jesus during his baptism. Some translations even remove the phrase "the Son of Man, which is in Heaven" because it sounded like a contradiction to them. It's true that Jesus did not ascend to Heaven at this point.  The context is about Jesus talking to Nicodemus about the Heavenly birth- to SEE the Kingdom of God. Jesus says he is the first born again Jew. By being born again with the Holy Spirit, Jesus has been given the secrets of Heaven (Ephesians 2:6 sitting in Heavenly Places) to share with the world.

 

 

John 3:13 Rendered Version No one has ascended into heaven except THE HOLY SPIRIT who descended from heaven, even the Son of Man which is in Heaven.

 

 

 

John 6:38 English Standard Version 38 For I have come down from heaven, not to do my own will but the will of him who sent me.

 

NOTE: See a similar explanation in John 3:13. We need to read John 6 in its entire context. Remember earlier he mentions his flesh as bread to eat. This is not literal. Therefore, the remainder of the passage should be considered figurative. In addition, the Father/Holy Spirit and Jesus are one in will and purpose. Jesus was born from the Holy Spirit of Heaven-the origin/source. The Holy Spirit from Heaven fertilized the egg of the virgin Mary to have Jesus. Heaven can be used figuratively for the birds of the air/Heaven and Heavenly Treasure. Jesus is the Man of Heaven. 


Alternatively, just like Moses went up/came down from Sinai bringing "Heaven" to the Israelites, Jesus had Heavenly knowledge/visions on mountains (Mount of Olives) as well. For example, he saw a vision of Moses/Elijah and his transfiguration in the mountains and "brought down"/revealed this Heavenly knowledge to his disciples-who shared it publicly at a later time. God's presence is not limited to Heaven-Genesis 3:8,4:16; Acts 3:20, Psalm 139:7-8, 63:1-3, 16:11, Exodus 33 :13-14. 


Furthermore, later on in John 6:41-43, the Jews had a tendency to take Jesus' figurative interpretations and make them literal in order to make him look foolish- See John 2:20, 8:57, 10:33 for some examples. Lastly, Jesus’ claimed Heavenly authority. He comes down with Heavenly authority from God-Matthew 7:29, John 8:28. 



John 6:38 Rendered Version 38 For I have come down with heavenly authority, not to do my own will but the will of him who sent me.

 

 

 

 

 

John 6:46 English Standard Version 46 not that anyone has seen the Father except he who is FROM God; he has seen the Father (to see is to be born again-John 3:3, 3:11-12, 3:36).

 

NOTE: Other alleged pre-existence verses are John 3:2 and 8:42. However, John the Baptist is FROM GOD AND SENT BY GOD according to John 1:6 To be FROM GOD AND SENT BY GOD IS THE SAME THING-John 8:42. Believers in 1 John 4:1-6 are FROM GOD. This is talking about an intimate relationship. See John 3:35, 5:20, 8:29, 10:17, 15:9, 17:23.

 

 

 


John 6:62 English Standard Version 62 Then what if you were to see the Son of Man ascending to where he was before?

 

NOTE: The Greek word is anabaino. It can also be translated to rise up according to Revelation 13:1. Also, if you read the entire chapter of John 6, it is talking about his resurrection, not his ascension in context. It is BEFORE DEATH, not a pre-existence state. "Before" is the Land of the Living.

 

 



John 16:28 New International Version 28 I came FROM the Father and entered the world; now I am leaving the world and going BACK to the Father.”

 

NOTE: The word BACK is not in the Greek. This is translator bias. This is

just Jesus ascending to Heaven. If Jesus had a pre-existence, this would contradict the latter part of John 3:13.

 

 

 

John 17:5 English Standard Version 5 And now, Father, glorify me in your own presence with the glory that I had with you before the world existed.

 

NOTE: The Father is going to glorify Jesus due to the glory that was promised through prophecy. The word "had" is echo in Greek . It should be translated as to possess or to have. "Before" can be described as in front of a group of people-a public declaration. The word "exist" can be translated as "the world to be" or "the inhabitants to be." The Greek word is Einai. This can be confirmed in Blue Letter Bible. This is describing the New Covenant saints (The Nations). They are the New Creation-John 1:12-13. An similar idea is found in the latter part in 1 Timothy 3:16 "......proclaimed among the nations."


 

John 17:5 Rendered Version 5 And now, Father, glorify me in your own presence with the glory that I WILL POSSESS with you in front of the New Covenant Creation.


Hebrews 7:3 English Standard Version 3 He is without father or mother or genealogy, having neither beginning of days nor end of life, but RESEMBLING the Son of God he continues a priest forever.

NOTE: First, Jesus had a father and mother: Joseph and Mary. Second, Ezra 2:62 can be used for support. Jesus was going to be a priest under a new order, not from the Levitical order. The order of Melchizedek came from unknown origins, Heavenly origins just like John's baptism-Matthew 21:25. If anything, Jesus' childhood/teenage years is unknown-before his baptism. Likewise, Enoch had an unknown death.


Ezra 2:62 English Standard Version 62 These sought their registration among those enrolled in the genealogies, but they were not found there, and so they were excluded from the priesthood as unclean.



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